My aunt is Queen Ma

Chapter 4 Zhu Biao's Shock

Ma Yu was not surprised to hear this question.

He was sure that the reason why Li Wen came to see him, a death row prisoner, in person was because of the red seal and iron certificate.

Talking about moving the capital and the like is just to open up the topic.

As for the reason, it's simple.

The matter of the red seal and iron certificate concerns the survival of their family and must be made clear.

Ma Yu did not answer this question directly.

When he talked to Li Wu, he was mainly complaining about Zhu Yuanzhang.

Of course, you can say whatever you want to say, and say it in the most bizarre and extreme way possible.

You can't use that attitude with Li Wen.

It was obvious that Li Wen and the people behind him had taken this matter seriously, and his answer now might very well determine the survival of their family.

Ma Yu himself was a death row prisoner and had no connection with the Li family, so naturally he didn't care what would happen to this family.

But in prison he was indeed taken care of by Li Wu.

A real man will avenge his enemies and repay his kindness.

Even if you can't help the other person, at least you shouldn't say anything that might harm them.

So, after thinking for a while, he asked:

"What is unrighteousness? What do you think is benevolence and righteousness for a monarch?"

Zhu Biao was stunned for a moment. He didn't expect the other party to ask such a question.

He couldn't help but fall into deep thought.

The benevolence and righteousness of the monarch?
Isn't it about working hard, loving the people, reducing taxes and levies, and having harmony between the ruler and his subjects... and creating a prosperous era?

But if you listen to what the other person is saying, there are other deeper meanings.

So what exactly is it?

After thinking for a long time without getting the point, he bowed and said:
"My writing is dull, please enlighten me, Brother Ma."

Ma Yu still did not answer directly, but asked again:

"Brother Li, what do you think of Emperor Gaozu of Han's killing of his meritorious officials?"

Zhu Biao subconsciously wanted to say that Emperor Gaozu of Han was mean and ungrateful, and slaughtered his meritorious officials. They could share hardships but not wealth.

But when the words came to my mouth, I realized that the problem was not that simple.

This matter has already been evaluated in history, so Ma Yu would not ask this question unnecessarily.

He must have had other intentions when asking this question.

Thinking back to the above conversation, he seemed to have some understanding.

But when he thought seriously about what he had realized, he couldn't put it into words vaguely.

This made him feel very uncomfortable.

Seeing his frown, Ma Yu thought to himself that he was still too young.

If it were an old fox who is well versed in politics, he would have understood the reason long ago.

But he is only thirteen or fourteen years old. It is not easy for him to have such knowledge. There is no need to demand too much.

So he said:
"What would have happened in the future if Emperor Gaozu of Han had not killed the kings of other surnames?"

These words sounded like a flash of lightning to Zhu Biao, splitting through the layers of fog and allowing him to see what was hidden.

When talking about the princes of the Han Dynasty, what is the first thing that comes to your mind?
Rebellion of the Seven Kings.

If this is the case for all descendants of Emperor Gaozu, the consequences would be even more serious if it were a king of a different surname.

It even plunged the world into war again.

In troubled times, people are worse than dogs in peaceful times. Zhu Biao knew the true meaning of this sentence very well.

Therefore, Emperor Gaozu of Han's elimination of kings of different surnames had nothing to do with benevolence and righteousness, but was intended to eliminate chaos.

In the long run, it will benefit the country and the people.

But... this answer was too unconventional and completely contrary to the education he received.

Zhu Biao was unable to accept it for a moment and retorted:

"But the kings of different surnames have all made great contributions. Emperor Gaozu of Han should find other ways to eliminate the danger."

"To directly send troops to attack and exterminate their entire clan would be unkind."

Ma Yu shook his head and said, "The way to eliminate the danger is actually very simple. Just learn from Changsha King Wu Rui."

Wu Rui, King of Changsha, took the initiative to give up part of his fiefdom to the court.

All gold, copper and other minerals within the fiefdom were turned over, and 60% of local taxes were turned over to the national treasury.

He also reduced his own army, retaining only a basic ceremonial guard.

Among the seven kings of different surnames in the early Han Dynasty, only the King of Changsha had a good end.

Moreover, the State of Changsha was passed down for four generations before it was abolished due to the extinction of its heirs.

Why was the struggle between the central government and the vassal kings so fierce in the early Han Dynasty, but the Changsha Kingdom was able to survive in peace?

Without him.

No threat.

To put it more simply, what Liu Bang eliminated was not the kings of different surnames, but the local forces that posed a threat to the central court.

It just happens that the king of a different surname has this ability.

According to historical records, Liu Bang conferred titles on 137 meritorious officials, 130 of whom had a good end.

There were only six kings of different surnames that Liu Bang personally dealt with, and this is all recorded in history.

So, who is saying that he is mean and ungrateful?
"Then the question arises: are Han Xin, Peng Yue, and the others willing to follow the example of the King of Changsha and voluntarily give up their own interests to reduce their own danger?"

Zhu Biao remained silent. The answer was very simple: impossible.

Blocking someone's financial resources is like killing their parents, not to mention that they are giving up greater power.

but……

"Since Emperor Gaozu of Han knew the dangers of vassal kings, why did he still enthronize descendants of the Liu family as kings? Couldn't he see the dangers involved?"

Ma Yu sighed, "He should understand that he is only doing this because of the situation."

"As for the reasons behind this... that involves another very large topic, unrelated to today's topic, so I won't elaborate on it."

"Now let's get back to the Red Book and Iron Certificate. Now you should understand why I said that possessing it means death, right?"

"Even if it wasn't Zhu Yuanzhang, any other emperor would make the same choice as long as he still had the world in his heart."

With the red book and iron certificate, it would be very difficult for future emperors to take action against the powerful and wealthy.

When the powerful and wealthy become too powerful and the imperial court loses its dignity, it is the way to the destruction of a country.

If the country does not exist, where will the hair attach to?

The people are the ultimate victims.

Any monarch with foresight would find a way to solve this problem.

Zhu Biao nodded, and all his misunderstandings about his father were cleared up.

It turns out that my father is not unkind... No, the so-called unkindness is actually the greatest kindness to all the people in the world.

Thinking of this, he suddenly understood.

Just as he was about to thank him, he heard Ma Yu change the subject and say:

"Of course, as you just said, there's more than one solution to the problem."

"If it were a broad-minded monarch like Emperor Gaozu of Han or Emperor Taizong of Tang, they would have found a way to take back the red seal and iron certificate."

"Zhu Yuanzhang is a mean and ungrateful person. He will probably kill both the person and the iron certificate."

After these last few words came out, Ma Yu felt refreshed.

Does this fit my personality as a black fan?

Those words just now were equivalent to whitewashing Zhu Yuanzhang...

As a Ming black fan... I feel sad...

Forget it, it's my fault for being so kind to the person who has helped me.

Zhu Biao was originally quite happy, and his impression of Ma Yu improved a lot.

After hearing the last few sentences, his expression suddenly froze.

Then there was a deep sense of helplessness. Ma Yu had a deep prejudice against his own father.

We have to find a way to resolve it, otherwise it won't work even if we want to forgive him.

But these are things for the future, let’s deal with the current issues first.

Then he stood up and saluted solemnly:
"I am deeply grateful for Brother Ma's teachings, and I will surely repay him handsomely in the future."

Ma Yu accepted the gift calmly, then waved his hand and said:

"There's no future. I really want to thank you. Just let me live the rest of my life comfortably."

"When Zhu Paopi comes back, I won't be able to enjoy it anymore."

Zhu Biao: ...

He took a deep breath, forced a smile and said:
"Brother Ma, he is the Son of Heaven after all. It is really against etiquette to address him like that."

Ma Yu said disdainfully, "Son of Heaven? Whose Son of Heaven is he?"

"I have never been a subject of the Ming Dynasty for a single day. Instead, my life is in danger because of the country he founded."

Zhu Biao explained, "That was all done by corrupt officials below. Your Majesty is unaware of it." Ma Yu interrupted him, "Who gave those officials the power? How can he be unrelated to the fact that others used the power he gave them to commit evil?"

A sentence suddenly popped up in Zhu Biao's mind: If all the people are guilty, the fault lies with me.

All the faults in the world are my fault.

With his own strength, he bears the sins of the people of the world.

He used to think that this sentence was majestic and that the person who could say it had a very broad mind.

But now, he felt helpless from these words.

As an emperor, whether you know what your officials have done or not, the blame will ultimately be on you.

Because you are the emperor, the power for those people to do evil comes from you.

This made him feel heavy in his heart.

However, the burden did not make him retreat, but instead stimulated his fighting spirit.

Carrying the well-being of all people in the world is the responsibility of the emperor.

If not, how can you be the Son of Heaven? If not, how can you be the ruler and father?

God has placed this world in the hands of my Zhu family, so we must live up to this destiny.

End the chaotic times and restore peace to the world.

Thinking of this, he straightened his shoulders and turned his gaze to Ma Yu.

The newly established Ming Dynasty needed talented people. Although this young man had an unknown background, he had extraordinary knowledge.

The analysis just now was so brilliant.

It's a pity to execute him like this.

But Ma Yu's attitude towards the emperor is problematic now. If this gets out, his father will become a laughing stock and his authority will be damaged.

He himself was doomed to die, and no one could save him.

Zhu Biao himself didn't realize that he had made his choice unknowingly.

No, he must change his attitude towards Daming and his father.

However, he has a deep prejudice in his heart, and forcing him to persuade is likely to backfire, so we have to think of another way.

With...

Zhu Biao's eyes turned and an idea came to his mind.

He smiled bitterly and said, "Brother Ma, I'm advising you this out of selfish motives."

"My brother and I are acquainted with you, and we had a very pleasant conversation."

"To be honest, I want to continue asking you questions in the future."

"But you address His Majesty by his name like this. If my brother turns a blind eye and word gets out, it could bring disaster to the entire clan."

Ma Yu scratched his head, it seemed to be true.

If someone calls the emperor's name directly and you do nothing about it, that is also a serious crime.

What? You mean human rights?

Stop joking. This is an imperial society. If you dare to talk about human rights with the emperor, it is a capital crime.

If I verbally greeted Zhu Yuanzhang in front of my brothers, it would really cause big trouble if it got out.

The key point is that if he really scares these two brothers away, his life in prison will be difficult.

Although I have accepted death, I don't want to suffer before death.

Forget it, I won’t scold him for now.

Thinking of this, Ma Yu showed an apologetic look on his face and said:
"I'm sorry, I was careless and almost put you in danger."

"From now on, as long as you are here, I will address him as the emperor."

Zhu Biao was delighted and said quickly, "Thank you, Brother Ma, for your understanding, but..."

Ma Yu asked puzzledly: "What's wrong?"

Zhu Biao said with shame on his face: "Many officials in Yingtian Prefecture know about our relationship."

"If you disrespect His Majesty in front of others...and His Majesty investigates, we will be held accountable as well."

"Brother Ma, please, for the sake of this little brother, please stop addressing His Majesty by his first name."

After saying this, he bowed repeatedly with an extremely sincere attitude.

As the saying goes, don't hit a smiling person. Although Ma Yu felt that the other party was getting too far, he didn't get angry at all.

He just said impatiently: "You...Okay, for Brother Li's sake, I won't curse him."

At this point, he complained:
"Just for this, he should make you a marquis."

Zhu Biao thanked him repeatedly, but he was also complaining in his heart.

He was even given a title of nobility. If I were not the crown prince, we would both be cut into pieces if this matter got out.

Not only is this person not afraid of death, he is also ignorant.

But he also noticed something.

Even death threats could not stop him from insulting the emperor, but a little care from his second brother made him change his tune.

Ma Yu is a man who clearly distinguishes between gratitude and resentment.

You cannot use force to deal with such people, but should bind them with kindness and righteousness.

It seems that my second brother has to stay in jail.

Then, Zhu Biao mentioned the matter of the red book and iron certificate again and expressed his gratitude to Ma Yu again.

In fact, this topic is almost over here.

Everything that needs to be said has been said, and the reasons have been analyzed very clearly.

If you take the red book and iron certificate, you will die. If you don’t want to die, find a way to refuse.

Continuing the conversation with the same old words is pointless and would just be a waste of breath.

So the two of them just had a brief conversation to wrap up and then changed the subject.

It was Zhu Biao who asked the question again, and he was still talking about other contents in the secret letter.

The topic naturally revolves around Zhu Yuanzhang.

After all, it was by insulting Zhu Yuanzhang that Ma Yu gained the respect of Zhu Chong, who was in a rebellious period and dissatisfied with his father's strict education.

He said a lot of things like 'Zhu Yuanzhang is Zhu Yuanzhang, and Zhu Chongba is Zhu Chongba'.

This undoubtedly means that Zhu Yuanzhang has forgotten his roots.

He even said frankly that although Zhu Yuanzhang came from a poor family, he would not really sympathize with the people.

And because of his humble origins, he would pay more attention to etiquette and rules.

For example, it was stipulated that everyone must kneel down when talking to him.

Many people think that it was normal to kneel down and talk to the emperor in ancient times.

Not only did they have to kneel before the emperor, but subordinates also had to kneel when they met their superiors.

However, this is not actually the case. Kneeling is only necessary during important ceremonies.

Normally, the people do not need to kneel when they meet officials, subordinates meet their superiors, and officials and common people meet the emperor.

Before the Tang Dynasty, officials were allowed to sit when attending court. It was not until the Song Dynasty that it was stipulated that officials must stand when attending court.

It was Zhu Yuanzhang who required officials and people to kneel when speaking to the emperor.

In his previous life, Ma Yu had often criticized him harshly for this point, and he had criticized him countless times after he traveled through time.

Zhu Biao had no way to explain this to his father.

Because there's really no way to explain this.

It is neither in line with ancient rituals nor in line with the ideas of benevolence and righteousness.

but……

If you say that my father doesn't care about the people, I can't tolerate it.

So he argued, "Your Majesty has issued many decrees requiring officials to treat the people well."

"We will severely punish corrupt officials who exploit the people and show no leniency. How can you say that Brother Ma has no sympathy for the people?"

Ma Yu sneered, "That's because he knows that the people will rebel if they can't survive."

"He severely punished corrupt officials only to maintain the rule of the Ming Dynasty."

Seeing Zhu Biao's expression of disapproval, he paused and said:
"Do you know what Emperor Zhu... thinks of Mencius?"

Zhu Biao was stunned for a moment. What does this have to do with how he views Mencius? But he still replied:
"Your Majesty does disagree with some of Mencius's ideas, but what does this have to do with whether he loves the people or not?"

Ma Yu said, "It's a huge deal."

"Let me put it this way: how we view Guan and Xun's thoughts determines the upper limit of a dynasty."

"How one views the thoughts of Confucius and Mencius determines the bottom line of a dynasty."

It was the first time that Zhu Biao heard the words "upper limit" and "lower limit", but he still understood their meaning.

Precisely because he understood, he was even more shocked.

This was the first time he had heard someone say this, and it was related to the rise and fall of a dynasty.

No, whether it is true or false, we must ask clearly.

"Oh? Wen is not well-informed, and this is the first time I've heard of this."

"I dare to ask Brother Ma for advice."

(End of this chapter)